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High intensity - moves at the very limit

Arno Wierer
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How do you think it's possible to increase the endurance on very hard moves at boulderprojects? To me it seems that all the strong boulderers have a excellent endurance on moves at their limit! In my case: If I try a crux move in a short 8a boulderproblem (can't climb harder at the moment)- it wouldn't be possible for me to add much more sequences afterwards with slightly less or equal difficulty, which means that I can hold up my very maximum strength for about 15 seconds or so, before the body becomes weaker during a redpoint attempt. So it would be very interesting for me to know if there is any trainingmethod to increase this kind of endurance from poor 15 seconds to 1 minute for example - which would make a very big difference in my opinion! (one grade for sure!!) Do you have any suggestions?? How would you train?
Jens Larssen
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This is what everyone wants :-) and there are several possibilities and of course it is acombination of beeing stronger and getting better endurance. I do not recommend a strict programme...just climb as much as you can without getting any lactid acid in the system. The key thing is to concentrate on your gripping technique. The reason why you can not continue for 1 minute is that you are loosing your finger position once you get tired. Goodluck!   
I think you should train maximum power. If you are strong enough to do 8b crux moves, then 8a will feel ok (even if it takes you 1 min to do the crux.
batu vladu
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this is called anaerobic endurance and there are many training articles/books covering the subject. Check out the following for a start: http://www.mountainzone.com/blogs/performance_training/2006/04/effective-training-for-forearm.html http://www.indoorclimbing.com.au/mag/intervals.htm
Tye Watkins
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@ Jens: No disrespect, but climbing below your anaerobic threshhold will do little for increasing anaerobic endurance. (Unless used solely as a base for further anaerobic training) Also, gripping technique? No. That is not why he cannot hold on after his body burns through the available ATP and CP. That is foolish training advice to give someone. If this person is climbing 8A boulders then he does not need to work on his gripping... I expect much better from you considering your coaching background. @ IsoNalle: Training POWER will also do almost nothing for your endurance. Training STRENGTH will. A stronger muscle takes longer to get fatigued when the same forces are applied. It should be noted however that there is an inverse relationship between endurance and strength. Batu Vladu is correct. The training you want to aim for is Anaerobic training. I suggest 4x4's and bouldering pyramids. Establishing a base of aerobic conditioning early in your season will also be helpful.
Jens Larssen
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@ Tye: I guess we can learn from some of the best rock climbers out there, that there is an alternative option of your 4 * 4 training :-)
Arno Wierer
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I think the facts that you should climb as much as you can without getting any lactid acid in the system as well as the suggestion from tye to do 4x4's and bouldering pyramids are really helpful. @ Tye: Beneath climbing lots of boulders (which is the main-thing of course) some 4x4 and pyramid sessions are the most relevant advices in my opinion. Till now I never put my emphasis on training methods but it seems that the higher a personal boulder-level is the more you have to search for possbilities to get stronger and more experienced, so I will try some additional anaerobic sessions. @ Jens: Due to my experiences on hard boulders that I made the last time I think loosing the right finger positon is a result of loosing the BODY TENSION during an attempt. If you haven't enough core (body) tension to climb a boulder then it's very difficult to palce your fingers AND your feet exactly on the right place. You need this ability not only in overhangs or roofs but also in vertical bouldering with small hand and footholds. But hell yeah! thanks for those advices Always good to learn from such "climbing scientists" ;-)
Tye Watkins
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I'm not exactly sure what your saying Jens.. Regardless, there are of course many ways to train for climbing. However, there is a physiologically correct training method for the desired effect. If you want to be able to do more moves at your limit, your need to increase anaerobic endurance. Interval training is one of the best, and easiest ways to implement this.
Bo Thomsen
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try keeping the rest' as low at max. 60 sec. and if it's a 10move or more problem, then hold 5 min. rest for every 10 repeats or so. and after 45 min. then take maybe 15 min. break. so you can keep up the quality and intensy, for a longer and sustained periode    
Could someone explain what 4x4 and bouldering pyramids are for someone less experienced?
Tye Watkins
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Bouldering pyramids are a circuit consisting of an decreasing number of climbs, as intensity increases. Ex: Climb 5 V0s, 4 V1, 3 V2, 2 V3, 1 V4 You could then go back down the way you came up. Pyramids are mainly used as a structured volume training device. You can input the rest where you need it depending on your needs and training goals. They make an excellent warm up, or can be used early on in the training cycle to build volume. You're basically just doing ALOT of climbing. 4x4's are one of my favorite training aids. They are basically interval training for bouldering (or routes) where you pick 4 climbs of somewhat similar difficulty and climb them back to back with no rest, followed by 4-5 minutes of rest, for 4 sets. (4 climbs, 4 sets = 4x4) A climber would possibly use something like: V4, V2, V5, V3 or anything really. Keep the boulder grades close, (or exactly the same) and climb on the steepest wall possible, preferably a cave or 45 with problems around 6-12 moves long. This is just the basic, standard variation of 4x4's. They do work for increasing Bouldering endurance though, and can translate nicely to increasing hard Route levels.